Mask on Mask off – (Karate Kid)
With changing regulations and guidance, we discuss the latest in mask mandates, the changes to the guidance and what that means to individuals in the choices they make. The guidance is varied throughout the US although the CDC guidance has stated that those who have been vaccinated do not need to wear a mask indoors or outdoors.
These guidelines are varied based on location, state and county regulations, specific circumstances such as healthcare, federal buildings, transportation and we still need to comply with the prevailing guidance, but if you do not have to wear a mask, should you?
We discuss why some people are still wearing masks and review some of the reasons why you might not need or want to and why you may also consider still wearing a mask.
Raw Transcript
Nick van Terheyden
Hi this is Dr. Nick on the incrementalist here with incremental insights for better business better health.
Fred Goldstein
And I’m Fred Goldstein with accountable health here helping employers look at the Employee Benefits programs, and improving employee health both post COVID as well as the broader issues impacted by how they offer those benefits and health plans. So let’s start this week, Nick, we’re starting to see this whole issue of masks and no longer being required to wear them. So how are you dealing with this?
Nick van Terheyden
I want to title this episode mask on mask off. If I’m channeling my Karate Kid, I am definitely in the mask off category. In the recent days, in fact, in the local space, we have relinquished the masking requirements essentially at a state level. There was some variation, a little bit of delay in county level, but essentially masked off at this point. And that has now permeated throughout the whole of the state. There are certainly some exceptions. I think in the metro, they’re still requiring it may be in federal buildings. And there’s wide variation and we experienced it over the weekend. Number one, I’m stuck in traffic. I haven’t been stuck in traffic in over a year. So everything feels like it’s back to normal. And I’m in different places. And I’m taking my mask off, I am entirely comfortable taking my mask off. I am fully vaccinated. My family is fully vaccinated. And based on the science I feel completely at ease. And that’s true in my gym. And I can tell you, the day that happened, I was with a group of people and they pretty much ripped their mask off. I was in the gym. Interestingly, this weekend, what I saw and I was really surprised was in places where the mask mandate had been lifted and not every business is done that we were certainly in some different businesses where they hadn’t but let’s pick the Home Depot. They have essentially removed the sign so they didn’t put a sign saying no mask required. So they’re not being quite that overt about it, but they removed the sign. And I’m happy to take I was in a tiny minority of individuals and I looked around everybody still wearing masks. wearing masks outside. And certainly across the board, I probably saw two people in the Home Depot. And I saw lots of folks, whilst I was in there. I’m entirely comfortable. Fred, you’re at the other end of the spectrum, why should we still be wearing masks?
Fred Goldstein
It’s a great question. So what this gets to is you’ve always talked about, there’s the science. And then there’s the other, right? And so the science, you’re right, the science says, if you’ve been vaccinated, you’re very unlikely to get infected. And if you do, it’s typically going to be very light, if at all. And so it now becomes a psychological issue. And we have been wearing masks for a long time, I still wear them indoors. As a matter of fact, it’s a funny little story, I was up, you know, moving my son back from college, and, and I walked into the frat house, to go ahead and use the restroom. And I realized I didn’t stick my mask on, I got a little nervous. And, and so I quickly put it on. But it’s gonna be fascinating to watch how this progresses over time. There are clearly individuals who are going to continue to wear masks here in Florida, we haven’t had the mass mandate, some stores are saying recommended. We’re still seeing a decent number in the stores. But obviously a lot more without the question becomes how many people in a given community have been vaccinated. And obviously, certain states are ahead of others or communities are ahead of others. And that I think is sort of the critical issue. But it’ll be fascinating to watch over time, what happens with individuals, myself included, will I begin to get a little less nervous and stop wearing a mask, because obviously, the science as it works, and fascinatingly, along these lines, Israel is going to lift all restrictions for for vaccinated and unvaccinated individuals, green paths that will go and you’re going to be able to do activities. So essentially, all of the individuals who have chosen to vaccinate are making it better for everybody else.
Nick van Terheyden
Right. And let’s focus in on that and clarify. So from a mass mandate, the guidance is still pretty clear if you have been fully vaccinated. So you’ve either had both doses, or you had the single dose j&j and your two weeks post, then you are not required to wear a mask, except in specific circumstances. If you haven’t, you are still supposed to wear your mask. But there is no way of really validating that because no industry or business as yet. I know, certainly some are thinking about this, I know with hearing about this from conferences, and you know, questions about that. And, you know, we’re not going to dive into that today. But you’re essentially taking on trust. And I recognize that there are clearly people in that group who take their mask off that may well not have been vaccinated. But here’s my perspective on that, based on the science, yes, the maybe individuals in the community that I’m in, who have no mask on, but have not been vaccinated, so they’re at slightly higher risk, but number of things factoring one highly unlikely because we’ve seen this massive decline, both in the number of cases, you know, testing continues, certainly in hospitalization, and so forth, too. We also know that from a vaccinated standpoint, I am much more resistant. And even if I do catch it, I’m likely to be asymptomatic. So I may get the disease and not even know it, because it doesn’t show up from symptom. You know, I’ve got no symptoms to indicate unless I test which I’m not doing. And then if I do get symptoms, they’re typically mild. And my potential importantly, and I think this is something else, I heard from others where, you know, if you have people at risk in your community, so if you have young children who can’t be vaccinated, obviously, people are worrying in a different way. But your capacity, so if I get the disease, and I’m asymptomatic, so I don’t know or I mean, even have mild symptoms, and I’m not sure interesting in the data shows that we don’t spread it because it doesn’t appear in the nasal pharynx. It’s not there in sufficient dose to be able to spread it. So those are all for me sufficient reasons. And I recognize the groupthink and that the impact of other people’s behavior that influences but I’ve always been a free spirit of you know, I’ve taken my science to the extreme. I gotta be honest, I hate masks I always wanted to take I always advocated them based on the science but now I’m saying I’m happy taking
Fred Goldstein
And let me add one critical piece for all of the folks who are in health and health care us included. When you go to see your doctor or the hospital, please don’t argue wear a mask. They’ve been living this disease, they’ve been helping us doing incredible things, and it’s still a requirement. So go with that, please.
Nick van Terheyden
I would just add to that. My attitude here is also very clear. I’m not going to have a Rao about it, I would I carry my mask with me. The only time I don’t have my mask is because I forgot. Let’s be frank, you know, if you guys are not offering me a masseuse to help me, because I forgot it, then you know, there’s a minor problem there. But I do try and remember, but occasionally I forget, even in the peak of this, I forgot. I will never argue. I just, you know, it’s it’s not worth the Rao and it’s, you know, respectful to others I’m trying to do now if I felt symptomatic, then I would put a mask on or in fact, I would stay at home, which is something we’ve potentially learned. So there’s some good news out of all of this. We’re behaving slightly differently. We might see flu as a minor issue with few people getting it because of all of this. That would be great. Right?
Fred Goldstein
That would be fantastic. We’ll see how long it takes for me to get like you Nick. So once again, another fantastic week This is Fred goes through with accountable health. Thanks so much for watching this and if you’d like more information, please go to a cannibal health LLC COMM
Nick van Terheyden
And this is Dr. Nick on the incrementalist here with incremental insights for better business, better health.
